Friday 8 July 2011

CBS–a further comment!

As the co-ordinator of the Redbridge and Havering Ordinariate Exploratory Group I am obviously not against the Ordinariate – quite the reverse! But, following on from my comments on my blog on Tuesday, I am really surprised that the Trustees of the Confraternity of the Blessed Sacrament were unwise enough to make a grant of half the assets of CBS to the Ordinariate without some consultation amongst the membership. It seems to have been done with undue haste and what makes it even more questionable is that most of the Trustees are now priests of the Ordinariate.

I understand that this has now been referred to the Charity Commissioners

6 comments:

  1. Surprise is very often the precursor of enlightenment.

    The complaint to the Charity Commission was made by the Rev Paul Williamson - described in the Judgment of the Court of Appeal declaring him a vexatious litigant as "Mr" rather than "Father" Williamson. The judgments in the Williamson litigation made it clear beyond peradventure that the ultimate authority in matters of doctrine and order in the "church by law established" is Parliament.

    In those circumstances, it is a perfectly tenable view that the only safe haven for "catholic faith in the anglican tradition" is the Ordinariate rather than the CofE.

    I trust you are not arguing that Ordinariate priests are not catholics seeking to preserve anglican tradition.

    Now unless you believe that bread and wine purportedly consecrated by a man ordained by a female bishop or by a female minister is indeed the Blessed Sacrament, then you have to accept that any gift made today to a CofE parish is at great risk of being used in future in a manner which catholics would consider sacrilegious.

    Remember, that when a vicar or curate who considers himself catholic leaves a CofE parish (whether or not for the Ordinariate) there is no guarantee as to who the next incumbent might be - but the scacred vessels will remain behind.

    Think how catholics must have felt at the Reformation when their gifts to Holy Mother Church (as they thought in perpetuity) were grabbed by the state and more often than not desecrated.

    It's an uncomfortable time and trustees are not delegates. They have a duty to further the objects of the trust. So while the speed of the decision makes me uncomfortable, I think makig any donation to a CofE parish at this time is a much riskier business than making a donation to the Ordinariate.

    Quid Vobis Videtur?

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  2. A sane comment at last

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  3. Well said, Mourad. Whilst I respect anyone who decides they will stay in the CofE I'm a little frustrated by the "head in the sand" approach of many of them. Two new PEVs, although welcome, have not changed anything.

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  4. Maurad,

    Are you saying that no valid catholic priests within the C of England? Is this why those priests who left to join the ordinariate agreed to be ordained by Rome - obviously Rome has not recognised those orders since Leo XIII's bull.

    The priests who joined the ordinariate had, unless they were being duplicitous, themselves believed that they were validly ordained catholic priests who were ministering valid sacraments while priests within the C of E.

    They are still catholic priests in the C of E who are struggling to sustain the catholic faith within that body - this was the purpose for which CBS twas founded - ie to maintain the catholic faith within the Anglican communion. CBS has not changed, its purpose remains the same.

    CBS was never set up to support anglican priests, who have openly rejected the validity of their orders so as to be (re)ordained as catholic priests who are recognised by Rome.

    The ordinariate is part of the Church of Rome - it is a personal prelature of the Bishop of Rome. It is not Anglican!
    ----
    The FAQ on the Ordinariate's website reads
    Question 2: Are members of the Ordinariate still Anglicans?

    Answer: No. Members of the Ordinariate will be Catholics. Their decision is to leave the Anglican Communion and come into the Catholic Church, in full communion with the Pope.
    ----

    Those who join the Ordinariate do not become 'Roman Catholic' for the first time, but as the answer says "Members of the Ordinariate will be Catholics." ie, they become 'catholic' for the first time.

    The Ordinariate denies that the Anglican communion as ever been catholic,denies that the anglican communion ever had valid apostolic orders. How can anyone therefore seriously argue that is it a continuation of the purpose for which CBS was founded?

    Get real folks!

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  5. Dear Anon:

    Whatever may have been the purpose of the CBS at its foundation, I suggest you look at its present charitable objects on the Charities Commission website:-

    FOR THE ADVANCEMENT OF THE CATHOLIC FAITH IN THE ANGLICAN TRADITION AND IN PARTICULAR TO PROMOTE:- (A) THE HONOUR DUE TO JESUS CHRIST OUR LORD IN THE BLESSED SACRAMENT OF HIS BODY AND BLOOD (B) PRAYER FOR ONE ANOTHER AT THE EUCHARIST (C) CAREFUL PREPARATION FOR AND RECEPTION OF THE HOLY COMMUNION, INCLUDING THE EUCHARISTIC FAST (D) THE REVERENT AND DIGNIFIED CELEBRATION OF THE EUCHARIST AND THE RESERVATION AND VENERATION OF THE BLESSED SACRAMENT (E) THE CONTINUANCE OF THE CATHOLIC PRIESTHOOD, AND (F) CATHOLIC THEOLOGICAL TEACHING, LEARNING AND DEVELOPMENT.

    However any previous objectives may have read, what matters so far as the duty of the trustees is concerned is how they now read.

    As I understand it, the [Roman) Catholic Church does not require any former CofE clergyman to abjure any belief he may hold or have held in the validity or otherwise of his CofE Orders.

    The Leonine Bull was a legal determination in a matter where absolute certainty is desirable. But since the Council of Trent decided that the sacrament of holy orders cannot be conferred twice, one or other of the ceremonies must of necessity have been void. It is unnecessary to determine which.

    Since the legal decision of the Holy See was not made ex cathedra, as a matter of private belief, I am free to have my own view of the matter and in theory, since it is a decision on a proposition, it could be reversed on sufficiently probative fresh evidence which scholars are free to research and consider.

    Let me put your own assertion another way:

    There are still a diminishing number of clergymen in the Church of England by law established who think of themselves as "catholic" and who are struggling to maintain that belief in a church which seems determined to make it increasingly difficult (if not yet impossible for all) conscientiously to hold that belief.

    So it is as well that the Ordinariate has been erected and as well that the CBS has amended its objects so as to enable the support of those holy men (and women) who discern that they cannot in conscience remain out of communion with Rome.

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  6. I understand that all the records from the start of the CBS were destroyed because of persecution by Church of England bishops - so nothing new is there!

    Like many of the "Catholic" Societies I suspect the CBS founders would have been very positive about the Ordinariate and unlike the so called Catholic Bishops of the Church of England would have led their follows in the right direction rather than keep on moving the line in the sand!!

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